As you suggest, scripture presents us with a very high bar. Nonetheless, while one appears encouraged to leave revenge to The Lord (Romans 12:19), does it not leave us free to seek retribution? And then again, we have the exhortations of the Old Testament:
~If anyone injures his neighbor, whatever he has done must be done to him: (Leviticus 24:19)
~fracture for fracture, eye for eye, tooth for tooth. Just as he injured the other person, the same must be inflicted on him. (Leviticus 24:20)
~You must show no pity: life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, and foot for foot. (Deuteronomy 19:21)
~Moreover ye shall take no satisfaction for the life of a murderer, which is guilty of death: but he shall be surely put to death. (Numbers 35:31)
It seems that a theme of 'quid pro quo' justice prevails?
That's true, of the Old Testament. It's been said that the New Testament has superceded the Old in that regard (at least that is what us Catholics are taught). The "turn the other cheek" teaching from Jesus and other gospels. I will say there are times I prefer the Old Testament view, especially in regards to Fauxi. But the thing is it seems earthly revenge never seems to fulfill justice. They never really get what they deserve and it leaves us frustrated, and at least for me, strangely sad. Maybe this forgiveness thing is the way to go? Like I said, I'm still torn.
I hear you. I don't think any of us who have been treated like lepers will ever forget - that part is covered. Forgive? I'm still in the camp of forgiving only those who truly are sorry and express that, AND also change their lives never to treat people like that again. I know that's not forgiving, that's just forgiving on my terms. I'll keep praying for an answer and if I ever get a revelation I'll let you know!
Ya. Great thoughts. The greatest irony in all of this, for me, is this..
My brother is 2 years younger than me. He’s a Marxist. Literally. The Dean of Equity and Inclusion at a Major university. He gets paid an obscene amount of money to stuff ultra woke shit down the throats of young people. He’s also a massive hypocrite and, like all leftists, he’s never wrong. He and I have never gotten along. The only thing we agree on is that college sports is the ultimate racket.
In early February 2020 I sent an email to all my family members telling them that I smelled a rat with the China virus. I also gave them my ideas on prophylaxis, C, D, Zinc, Quercetin. His response was twofold. First I was a racist for calling it the China virus. Second, if I “darkened” his inbox again with any of my conspiracy bullshit he would cut me off. So of course I took the challenge and sent more emails and he did cut me off. I had zero contact with him until
a year later when he called me to rip me a new one because he found out I had told our 95 year old father to not get the jab.
I let him pontificate for a bit and then I told him that he was dead wrong and don’t call me again. Sadly, my dad did get jabbed. And then jabbed again. It’s a long story, but within 6 months of the 2nd jab he was dead from stage 4 metastatic bone cancer.
So because he was so sick and we had to move him to hospice I was forced to deal with my brother. And then after he died and because we were co-trustees we had to agree on a bunch of stuff. I wanted an autopsy, he did not so I eventually gave up.
But I made him give me POA in regards to my dads estate in return for giving up on the autopsy. That allowed me to liquidate all his holdings into cash. Which my brother did not want to do, and will never admit it was the correct move.
So now, a year after my dad died, I have occasional contact with my brother via email. I’m still working on estate issues so I need info from him. And that is the irony. The jab killed my otherwise very healthy father. And put me back in contact with my brother, albeit, only because there was no other way. Of course, he will never make the connection of the jab to the death. The cognitive dissonance in people like him is something I have never experienced in my 67 years.
But the irony of the circumstances just boggles my mind.
Sorry to hear about your dad. So many stories just like yours. So many families ripped apart over a bioweapon. But like you said, ripped apart yet brought together again. The irony. God works in mysterious ways, as they say.
I don't think the Midwestern part of the US has gotten any enlightenment and if so they are hiding. The wake-up call takes time to get through to our country areas.
Maybe because the Midwest wasn't so screwed up as the East and West coasts to begin with? I live in NY State and it was hell here in the covid insanity. Any movement toward just craziness is enlightenment here. Still I think we are now in the stage where non-lepers stay silent instead of berating the lepers. Will there come a day when non-lepers say sorry to us? Hopefully, I'd like that. But I don't expect that with human nature and all. Depends on where those fibrous blood clots are coming from and how many shotted people will be affected by them.
Indeed - it is a conundrum! True repentance does a complete 180 degree about-face and then seeks to restore. I'm not seeing that happening, at least in my circle.
I'm not either. But is true repentance needed for forgiveness by the person wronged? Is any repentance needed at all? That's the problem I am having. Can you forgive someone who doesn't know he/she was forgiven for a wrong they never thought was wrong? Does God forgive us all for our sins even if we don't believe in Him or ever confessed to Him? If so, does that mean Hitler and Fauxi is/will be in Heaven? So many questions, no answers.
Only a few lines written of this song, starts like this...
"If I DID what you SAID I'd be DEAD (!)
I'd say YOU'RE the one who's EFFED UP in the HEAD!
ad lib....best
As you suggest, scripture presents us with a very high bar. Nonetheless, while one appears encouraged to leave revenge to The Lord (Romans 12:19), does it not leave us free to seek retribution? And then again, we have the exhortations of the Old Testament:
~If anyone injures his neighbor, whatever he has done must be done to him: (Leviticus 24:19)
~fracture for fracture, eye for eye, tooth for tooth. Just as he injured the other person, the same must be inflicted on him. (Leviticus 24:20)
~You must show no pity: life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, and foot for foot. (Deuteronomy 19:21)
~Moreover ye shall take no satisfaction for the life of a murderer, which is guilty of death: but he shall be surely put to death. (Numbers 35:31)
It seems that a theme of 'quid pro quo' justice prevails?
That's true, of the Old Testament. It's been said that the New Testament has superceded the Old in that regard (at least that is what us Catholics are taught). The "turn the other cheek" teaching from Jesus and other gospels. I will say there are times I prefer the Old Testament view, especially in regards to Fauxi. But the thing is it seems earthly revenge never seems to fulfill justice. They never really get what they deserve and it leaves us frustrated, and at least for me, strangely sad. Maybe this forgiveness thing is the way to go? Like I said, I'm still torn.
If and when you get an answer let us know. I sure don’t have one. I’m still solidly entrenched in the never forget AND never forgive mode.
I hear you. I don't think any of us who have been treated like lepers will ever forget - that part is covered. Forgive? I'm still in the camp of forgiving only those who truly are sorry and express that, AND also change their lives never to treat people like that again. I know that's not forgiving, that's just forgiving on my terms. I'll keep praying for an answer and if I ever get a revelation I'll let you know!
Ya. Great thoughts. The greatest irony in all of this, for me, is this..
My brother is 2 years younger than me. He’s a Marxist. Literally. The Dean of Equity and Inclusion at a Major university. He gets paid an obscene amount of money to stuff ultra woke shit down the throats of young people. He’s also a massive hypocrite and, like all leftists, he’s never wrong. He and I have never gotten along. The only thing we agree on is that college sports is the ultimate racket.
In early February 2020 I sent an email to all my family members telling them that I smelled a rat with the China virus. I also gave them my ideas on prophylaxis, C, D, Zinc, Quercetin. His response was twofold. First I was a racist for calling it the China virus. Second, if I “darkened” his inbox again with any of my conspiracy bullshit he would cut me off. So of course I took the challenge and sent more emails and he did cut me off. I had zero contact with him until
a year later when he called me to rip me a new one because he found out I had told our 95 year old father to not get the jab.
I let him pontificate for a bit and then I told him that he was dead wrong and don’t call me again. Sadly, my dad did get jabbed. And then jabbed again. It’s a long story, but within 6 months of the 2nd jab he was dead from stage 4 metastatic bone cancer.
So because he was so sick and we had to move him to hospice I was forced to deal with my brother. And then after he died and because we were co-trustees we had to agree on a bunch of stuff. I wanted an autopsy, he did not so I eventually gave up.
But I made him give me POA in regards to my dads estate in return for giving up on the autopsy. That allowed me to liquidate all his holdings into cash. Which my brother did not want to do, and will never admit it was the correct move.
So now, a year after my dad died, I have occasional contact with my brother via email. I’m still working on estate issues so I need info from him. And that is the irony. The jab killed my otherwise very healthy father. And put me back in contact with my brother, albeit, only because there was no other way. Of course, he will never make the connection of the jab to the death. The cognitive dissonance in people like him is something I have never experienced in my 67 years.
But the irony of the circumstances just boggles my mind.
Sorry to hear about your dad. So many stories just like yours. So many families ripped apart over a bioweapon. But like you said, ripped apart yet brought together again. The irony. God works in mysterious ways, as they say.
I don't think the Midwestern part of the US has gotten any enlightenment and if so they are hiding. The wake-up call takes time to get through to our country areas.
Maybe because the Midwest wasn't so screwed up as the East and West coasts to begin with? I live in NY State and it was hell here in the covid insanity. Any movement toward just craziness is enlightenment here. Still I think we are now in the stage where non-lepers stay silent instead of berating the lepers. Will there come a day when non-lepers say sorry to us? Hopefully, I'd like that. But I don't expect that with human nature and all. Depends on where those fibrous blood clots are coming from and how many shotted people will be affected by them.
Indeed - it is a conundrum! True repentance does a complete 180 degree about-face and then seeks to restore. I'm not seeing that happening, at least in my circle.
I'm not either. But is true repentance needed for forgiveness by the person wronged? Is any repentance needed at all? That's the problem I am having. Can you forgive someone who doesn't know he/she was forgiven for a wrong they never thought was wrong? Does God forgive us all for our sins even if we don't believe in Him or ever confessed to Him? If so, does that mean Hitler and Fauxi is/will be in Heaven? So many questions, no answers.